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| Piotr Turkiewicz |
By
David Cristol
In November 2025, the 22nd edition of Jazztopad took place in Wrocław,
Poland, with David Murray, Wadada Leo Smith, Midori Takada, Marta
Sánchez, Camila Nebbia, Kahil El’Zabar, Jakob Bro, Immanuel Wilkins,
Joanna Duda, Xhosa Cole, Jeremy Rose, Luke Stewart, Charles Lloyd and
others performing. Artists from a varied geographical provenance and
exhibiting a wide stylistic scope performed. A strong Polish presence
was felt, both with local string ensembles and at improvised sessions.
We asked programmer Piotr Turkiewicz about how it began, from a small
festival to one of the leading music celebrations in Europe, with a
focus on unusual settings, unprecedented encounters, premieres,
commissions, partnerships with faraway organizations (Canada, Australia)
and doing a New York edition.
David Cristol: how did it all begin, when did you join the festival and become its
artistic director ?
Piotr Turkiewicz:
I started collaborating with what was then called Wroclaw Philharmonic (now
National Forum of Music) in 2006. There is another festival here, a
classical music festival, Wratislavia Cantans, which is one of the biggest
classical festivals focused on the human voice. I was asked to help out the
artistic director of the festival, who was British conductor Paul McCreesh.
That's how I got associated with this institution that was running this
classical music festival and was also planning to build the Narodowe Forum
Muzyki – a new concert hall. I started traveling a lot. The old venue had a
festival with the same name, Jazztopad, which ran for three years. It was
honestly quite cheesy, jazzy symphonic music, swinging double basses, this
kind of vibe. After the third edition I was asked by then director Andrzej
Kosendiak if I wanted to take over and develop it. That's how it started.
That was the third edition, and last year was the twenty-second.
PT:
I've been doing this for nineteen years, which doesn't feel like it because
it's been changing so much. The core idea is still there, which means
pushing the program as far as I can. I want to get rid of the « jazz » in
the name at some point because it took a long time for people to come and
trust the festival choices rather than the « jazz » brand. We started commissioning new music, which is a big part of the festival. Since there
was an institution behind it, which had resident ensembles, we started commissioning works for them, symphony orchestras, chamber, cello quartet,
string quartet, choir, chamber orchestra. Jazztopad is part of it because
it's under the same umbrella. We started using those ensembles as part of
the festival. I believe that's how the festival started to grow because
there were a lot of artists who were challenged and interested in doing
something different.
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Wadada Leo Smith and Jakob Bro. Photo Joanna Stoga
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Is that where the connection with the string ensembles come from?
PT: Sure. I used to play cello, and played at my first
edition. The connection with strings and especially with the cello is always
there, somewhere. But it just started growing like crazy at some point,
which was a beautiful thing because when we started, I was designing the
poster, going around the city with flyers and so on. We invited Kenny
Wheeler, whose music I remembered from childhood. He was one of the first
artists I recognized as a kid. I got in touch with him and said,
« we have a festival, it's super small and we have no money. Would you
like to come? »
And he came. I was about trying to talk to artists, not go through agencies.
Even though it got bigger, we still have a direct connection with artists,
it's really about the relationship with folks. The Jakob Bro piece with
Wadada that you heard would not have happened otherwise.
It was an unusual gig for Wadada as part of his declared last tour in
Europe.
PT: It's a combination between trying to fit into what they
do and also take them out of it for a couple of days. We often fly people
over just for what they do here. One of the breakthroughs was, we did the
last concert by Sonny Rollins. We started building a relationship with
Charles Lloyd, which ended up being a lot of commissions, and his
Wild Man Dance
album being a live recording at the festival. And we had a beautiful
collaboration with Wayne Shorter, he wrote music for wind ensemble for the
festival. So it started to grow even though we had a terrible concert hall,
an old communist building of about 400 seats, with a terrible sound and
smell. People didn’t like to go there, we couldn’t sell tickets. That's why
we started house concerts. We needed to go out of this hall to people's
houses and establish a connection with the audience. We needed to find
another way of presenting the music. It's been thirteen, maybe fourteen
years that house concerts are happening. Every year it's different places,
except for two houses where we come back to. Two amazing houses and people
who've been with us almost from the beginning. Fans of the festival like to
celebrate, they need that kind of space, they need to be there. That's like
a feast, a wedding. You go in there and you're like,
« Jesus, incredible ! »
You don’t know who’s gonna play until you’re attending. It’s eight different
houses over two weekends, with three or more sets in each.
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| Camila Nebbia Presencia. Photo Slawek Przerwa |
How long has the Narodowe Forum Muzyki been in operation ?
PT:
Ten years. It was quite a challenge, moving from a small hall to this place.
We suddenly needed to fill 1400 seats. Actually, the whole venue is 1,800
seats. Suddenly four times more people.
I thought the reversed stage felt and sounded better than the opening
and closing evenings in the traditionally-shaped room.
PT: I like it much more, it’s my favorite setup. It's more
intimate and closer. I always address this division between stage and
audience, this artificial separation. Most artists want to be close to the
audience. Some don't care, but some do. I'm trying to work with those who
care. So we found this setup, and I thought this is beautiful, better for
the music that we present. Of course, there are bigger names in the program
too, but even David Murray doesn't usually sell out venues like this. This
year, last year, three years ago, everything was sold out. And when you look
at the how the tickets are selling, the most challenging and unknown acts
are selling first. Which is incredible.
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| David Murray Quartet. Photo Slawek Przerwa |
You built an audience who is open to new propositions.
PT: It took a long time. Between the house concerts and
what happens at the club at night, it helped push things further. We push
further every year, a little bit. The first couple of years were hard
because people were complaining : « oh, this is not jazz. » but I
was also lucky because people who ran this new venue and the previous venue,
they just trusted me. I mean, it's pretty rare. I have the same situation in
Berlin where I program a venue, and it's the same thing. It's also a dream
place, even in terms of the design of the hall, it's ideal because it's
round, beautiful – it’s called Pierre Boulez Saal.
Until around 2007, there was nobody from Poland as part of the Europe Jazz
network nor at Jazzahead. It's hard to imagine now, but finally Poland has a
stand. Before that, there was nothing. Just to give you perspective, when I
started traveling because of the festival, nobody knew anything about the
Polish jazz scene. They knew Tomasz Stanko, that's it. That was the only
name known outside of Poland. When Charles Lloyd decided to write new music
for us and released it, that was an important moment because he was changing
from ECM to Blue Note. That was a huge push for us because the record was
everywhere. While in Japan at that time, I would go to a record store and
see big posters of Charles Lloyd/Jazztopad and I was like, «
wow ! »
It was a breakthrough, people started paying attention, asking Charles Lloyd
« What's this festival? Why did you write music for them? ». We
slowly got more recognition.
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| Ghosted. Photo Joanna Stoga |
How about documentation ?
PT:
We record every concert. We have our archive. Things will come out. Kris
Davis is releasing something soon that we recorded here, as well as Nicole
Mitchell, James Brandon Lewis….
Jakob Bro’s « Fox on Hill » composition was only happening here.
PT: Only here. I don't remember the last time I got so
emotional about music. Maybe it was me, having a lot of things on my mind.
The composition was something else and unlike any other concert by Wadada.
This situation of him as an interpreter is very rare. I think it was
interesting for him to go through that process. He's one of those musicians,
every sound he plays, it goes straight to your heart. It's such an honor
just to spend time with him. He's a generous, beautiful human being. In 2014
we commissioned him to write for a symphony orchestra, that was the first
time we worked together. A huge piece, dedicated to Solidarność, the strike
movement in Poland in the eighties, with visuals.
It must have spoken to him because he’s concerned about democracy.
PT: Big time. It's a beautiful thing to be able to work
with him, but also, I think because of what we've been doing almost twenty
years now, it feels natural. With Jakob Bro, with Charles Lloyd. They've
been here before, they know us, they trust us. It's much easier to do
something different from that point on. That always was the aim of the
festival, to work closely with artists. There are a lot of festivals who are
just booking gigs. The bands are on tour, they’ll stop here, play the album,
that's it. It's very easy. I can book those in two days if I want to,
emailing three agencies, you know, Saudades and so on. Boring.
Commissions take a lot of energy but it's a very rewarding
process. It's also taking a lot of risks. You don't know what's gonna
happen. Likewise when you put musicians together for the first time. For
example, the duo with Marta Sanchez and Luke Stewart
[from the David Murray Quartet]
was a first time. I'm always sure something beautiful is gonna happen, but
who knows ? There's a lot about the festival that’s unpredictable, that's
what makes it exciting for our audience. From my point of view, it's an
extra value to have that because it's not something you can see everywhere.
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| Joanna Duda The Great Reset. Photo Joanna Stoga |
How did the idea happen to do a leg of the festival in New York? When
did it start? PT: During the 2013 edition in Wrocław, producer Jason
Olaine from Jazz at Lincoln Center visited us. We had a Turkish focus then
with a lot of Turkish free jazz musicians, pushing hard, and he loved the
festival vibe. He felt good and said «
listen, why don't you bring some Polish artists to Dizzy's? »
That's how it started. At first, it was a one-day thing. We did it again and
it was two days, and then we did it again. I've been coming to New York
since 2003 on a regular basis and started connecting with people. We were at
The Jazz Standard, Cornelia Street Cafe - those places don't exist anymore.
Also National Sawdust, and house concerts as well. But we never wanted to do
a government-sponsored Polish festival. From the very beginning when he
invited us, I said
« I would love to do it, but we need to collaborate. You need to invest
money into what we do. Otherwise, it's not gonna happen. I'm not gonna
ask the government to pay for everything because then five people will
show up and it doesn't make sense, it's gonna be one of those artificial
presentations of whatever country's scene because they have money. »
The biggest challenge was to find the right partners who are excited about
what we do and want to collaborate and pay for it. The Polish Cultural
Institute in New York has been supportive. We got a sort of «
you can't miss it »
label from the New York Times, which was an important moment. The buzz
started. We have partners I love working with and are very supportive, but
it's more difficult than ever because of the political situation. It’s a
kind of a suicidal endeavour when you think about it :
« let's bring unknown Polish artist to New York where there's a hundred
other concerts with amazing lineups ! »
[laughs] This is the city where you have the most things going on
at the same time, super competitive. So it's been a journey. Some things
didn’t work out with people I thought I could rely upon. Some venues didn't
put any work into it. We had concerts where five people showed up, but then,
that happens every day in New York. There was a Polish journalist who came
to the festival. He hadn't been to New York before, came a few days earlier
and started going to gigs. When I met him, he said,
« it's incredible, every day is like a festival here. But the clubs are
empty. Some places I went to, there was, like, five people. »
I replied,
« If you didn't have this experience, you would think that we are
failing, but that's New York. »
Then he saw concerts where we had 300 people and was surprisedall
those people came to see Polish artists.In June of 2025, every
concert was packed. Even Tuesday evening at Dizzy's, the worst day of the
week. They told me, « man, on Tuesdays we really struggle ». It was
sold out, two sets. So it takes time, when you're pushing and trying to
communicate and encourage people to pay attention. And maybe the audience
appreciates that it's a different thing. What’s new in New York? You have
everything there every day. Actually not true because we started inviting
artists who'd never played there. From Poland, Japan, Australia. We invited
Michiyo Yagi, who only was in New York twenty years ago. It would be a dream
to present the project with Wadada Leo Smith and Jakob Bro in New York, with
the cellos. We need to find people who are interested, willing to put up the
money and so on. Every time I have a setback I'm trying to think, I can make
this happen. Every year is like a new start.
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| Immanuel Wilkins & Lutoslawski String Quartet. Photo Slawek Przerw |
Are you doing it again in '26?
PT: Hopefully, yes. It depends on different things : if I
can do what I want to do, if our partners will finance it on the level that
we need to. We have the dates and are almost ready. But I'm still like, if I
stop It doesn't matter, nobody will notice. I mean, it's New York. 2025
was very successful though. Last two, three years I finally felt this made
sense. It's a lot of work and when you think about doing this festival here
in Wrocław and programming events in Berlin and now also in Banff you kind
of lose momentum, but at the same time you get a lot of energy when things
happen.
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| Concert in Living Room, Piotr Turkiewicz (right). Photo Karol Adam Sokolowski |
What would you say is the festival’s ethos?
PT: What's most important is community. We have a community
; I don't know the better word for it right now. Our audience and musicians
who come back, that's the strength of the festival. We are supported by
people who believe in what we do. It gives us strength to keep on going and
pushing. I'm grateful because it's not a given. Community is the artists,
audience, reporters, owners of the private apartments, everybody. I've
always wanted to create a space for people to feel that we're in it
together, that it's not just buying a ticket, seeing a show and going back
home. It has to be some kind of experience. Even if it's a bad experience.
After Jakob Bro’s Fox on Hill concert, there were extreme ways
people felt about it. Some were crying during the piece. Some were just
mesmerized. And some were like,
« What the hell was it? Wadada could have played more, Jakob didn't play
at all. »
The piece is what it is, it’s not about the number of notes played. The
worst concerts are those where people go out, and they're like,
whatever - nothing happened
. I love it when they dislike it and I love it when they love it. This is
how it should be. Because that means something relevant happened.
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