Max Johnson - Sunday Interview ~ The Free Jazz Collective

Sunday, December 17, 2023

Max Johnson - Sunday Interview

Sunday, December 17, 2023 Sunday Interview No comments

Max Johnson. Photo by Aidan Grant

What is your greatest joy in improvised music?

I think there’s something magical about great improvised music, and I come to appreciate it more and more as I go through more musical experiences. As someone who composes non-improvising music, plays songs, straight ahead jazz, and studies different traditions, there’s something mysterious and beautiful about freely improvised or spontaneously created music. The ability to build something from no pre-established forms communally with others is one of the most truly democratic and collaborative things I’ve ever experienced, and it stands in opposition to the top-down capitalist model of making music to sell. People come together to create something as a community, and there’s no room for ego or pre-conceived ideas of what has to happen to succeed, because if there is, the music can’t move forward. And every combination of musicians and instruments creates different results, like ingredients in a meal. As a listener (whether on stage or off), getting to experience all sorts of combinations of musicians and see how those voices change each other and create something greater is a beautiful thing.
What quality do you most admire in the musicians you perform with?

While I try to be open minded and enjoy the diversity of different musical styles and voices of the people I play with, when it comes to improvisors, I like to surround myself with musicians who see the big picture and can look forward and backward in the music thinking formally. Improvisors who are composers often can see the big picture, and it’s really clear when you’re listening to Roscoe Mitchell or Anthony Braxton that they’re constantly looking ahead in the music while also keeping track of where it’s been. Patience is really important to me as well, and it can show itself in many different ways in the music.
Which historical musician/improviser do you admire most?

The first person that comes to mind is Mingus. There’s something so tenacious about everything he did. He was composing this incredibly complex concert music as a teenager, and then became the most virtuosic bassist of the 40’s and 50’s, then started an artist run label with Max Roach, and that’s not even talking about his bandleading which was an art in itself, putting together these very different distinct voices within compositions that let them all be individuals. It's incredible the amount of reinventing and creating that he did; he mastered five or six complete things in one reasonably short lifetime. It’s insane!
If you could resurrect a musician to perform with, who would it be?

As far as a resurrected musician I could perform with, there’s too many to name, as it’d be incredible just to feel what it was like to interact with any of these folks. Off the top of my head Coltrane certainly comes first, but Eric Dolphy, Steve Lacy, Elvin Jones, Andrew Hill, Art Blakey, Lee Morgan, and John Gilmore, but there’s so many living people it’d be a dream to play with too! The world is just full of heroes!
What would you still like to achieve musically in your life?

I’d love to tour more; it’s always a pleasure to present my music to new people. I’d love to compose something for a large ensemble of some kind as well. And I would love to be able to figure out a way to sustainably keep making recordings of my own and releasing recordings by other people I can support with my label Unbroken Sounds. With the recording industry in shambles and streaming corporations taking everything they can from artists, it’s becoming harder and harder to produce music, so I’d love to achieve a way to just keep making new things and trying to push myself to new places!
Are you interested in popular music and – if yes, what music/artist do you particularly like?

There’s certainly popular music from different eras I enjoy, but I don’t really like music that is created in the focus-group corporate pop model that currently rules so much of that scene. All the modern hip hop or song-based music I enjoy tends to be by independent artists who have more say in the music rather than ones produced by big companies where artists are a product. But if you like it you like it! I try not to judge people for liking things I don’t and find so many artists to be hyper judgmental about popular music fans. We all get to like different stuff!
If you could change one thing about yourself what would it be?

As someone who struggles with a psychological handicap, it would be great if I didn’t have to deal with the constant pushing up against mental difficulties. I’m a very driven and always working person, and especially since I’ve had some of these issues exacerbated by long covid symptoms, I just don’t have as much mental energy to spend, and I wish I didn’t have those issues impeding my productivity. But honestly if I could change anything, especially these days, even in jazz, it would be to have a bunch of money. More and more publicity is becoming the only way that artists break through, and as a low-income person, I just can’t afford to compete with the people who have money. Practically every name jazz artist today has a PR campaign behind them, often costing more than the records themselves to make, and also often costing more than your income from playing music, so the only people who can afford it are those with some extra-monetary source. I see so many great artists who also don’t have money go unnoticed or aren’t working because they don’t have the resources that others have. You’re expected to have records, professionally shot videos for every project, press photos, and on top of that, there are a number of press outlets (thank goodness not FreeJazzBlog, thanks guys!) who will only accept reviews from PR agents, and festivals that will only book people with PR. So it’s a constant frustration I see folks like myself dealing with, not just in music but in America in everyday life.
Which of your albums are you most proud of?

If I have to pick one, I’ll say “Orbit of Sound” by my trio with Anna Webber & Michael Sarin. There’s a real care and patience with that record that comes from the fact that we’d been playing and touring that music before we recorded it, and the musical trust I have in those two individuals really allows the music to go anywhere we want without judgement. We’ll be recording a new one this winter after our tour on the east coast of the US, Germany, Austria, and Slovenia this fall, and I think we’ll be able to build on some of those ideas.

Another record that means something to me but for a different reason is a duo album I am releasing (or have released, depending on when this is printed) with Henry Grimes, recorded live at the Stone in 2010. Henry was my teacher, mentor, and friend and this is the only recording I have of us performing together publicly. He is the reason I play the bass, and I found this recording of us and wanted to share it because he meant so much to me. I think his post-return playing is incredibly underrated and often misunderstood, and I just wanted there to be some more documentation of his brilliant and patient work out there.
Once an album of yours is released do you still listen to it? And how often?

I listen to my albums a lot after recording them because I edit, mix, and (recently) master them myself. I usually mix over the course of a few months, tinkering very slowly, so once it’s out I usually don’t listen too much, but I do sometimes get curious when I’m trying to remember what something sounded like and go back. It’s nice to remind myself on my most depressed days that A. I do know how to play the bass, and B. I’ve put out a lot of music, and I can keep going.
Which album (from any musician) have you listened to the most in your life?

I don’t really have a single album that’s my go to, and my tastes have changed over the years, but I always go back to “Changes One” by Charles Mingus, “Fun House” by the Stooges, “Escalator Over the Hill” by Carla Bley, “Live at the Village Vanguard” by John Coltrane, the recording of “Derive 2” by Pierre Boulez, a box set of Bill Monroe recordings from the 1950s, “Black Sabbath” by Black Sabbath, and plenty of stuff I can’t remember right now.
What are you listening to at the moment?

I’ve been listening to a lot of Andrew Hill lately. Richard Davis was the first upright bass player I really listened to, and I’ve been really enjoying his absolutely fearless playing on those records, and also now appreciating Andrew so much more as a composer (now that I have better ears than when I was 20). Also Bill Dixon, whose work I always enjoyed but never immersed myself in. Also also I’m composing a solo piano piece for the incredible new music pianist Steven Beck, so I’m listening to a lot of modernist piano music by Don Martino, Elliott Carter, and Charles Wuorinen. Also also also I’ve been really enjoying those 1950s Duke Ellington recordings of his long concert arrangements, and Norman Blake is a go-to when I’m around my house as well.